Does beating a guy FIRST make it a better win?

Ward has fans?

 

Yes. They are also called Ward. Or have some other colourful name.

 

I do think it can matter, but there is no general applicability or rule of thumb. Some fighters have more fragile egos than others and a defeat after a lengthy unbeaten run can adversely affect that type of guy more than others IMO.

MTF

 

Whose win was more significant? Buster Douglas over Tyson or Evander Holyfield's? was Tyson a better fighter after eight straight wins before Evander's bout?

On the other hand, Oscar De La Hoya's first defeat against Felix Trinidad, even though a bad decision, was more significant than when he later loses FOR REAL against Mosley. The Tito fight official 'defeat' was more publicized and got more words written than his truly first defeat against Mosley.

 

I disagree! Trinidad's win over ODH was viewed as a draw at best. And the only buzz about it was either that it was a bad decision or that ODH pussied out and threw the fight away. The story was never about how good Trinidad was, or how impressive it was that he beat ODH.

It was only through subsequent wins over Reid and Vargas that Trinidad's status peaked.

Mosley's win, on the other hand, was seen nearly unanimously as impressive, and it propelled Mosley to P4P #1 status and represented his peak as a fighter.

Mosley's win over ODH is actually a good example of a win over an opponent that counted more than someone else's (Trinidad's) earlier win.

 

Trinidad was already a huge draw before his fight with DLH. Mosley was just never a big draw, period (at least not on the level of DLH or Tito).

 

He was a star before the ODH fight. It's why the fight sold so well, why it took so long to make, and why it almost didn't happen.

And Trinidad's win over ODH was not celebrated. It wasn't until he beat Reid and then Vargas that he regained and even improved on the status he had going into the ODH fight.

Nobody points to Trinidad's win over ODH to show how good he was. But Mosley? It's the primary case.

 

Buster Douglas signed a 30 million contract with Donald Trump after beating Tyson and even had his own video game! Then Evander Holyfield came and ruined everything.

 

More HYPERBOLE from Good Ol' Shits & Giggles...



REED:shit:

 

Speaking of Duran, as IMPRESSIVE as DeJesus' Win Over him was, Leonard MINDFUCKED a Better Version...



REED:Lok:

 

Yet Roy Jones Fought "No One of Note"???...Brilliant!!!...This is Where the Exaggeration Game Perpetually BITES U in the Ass, Ike...



REED:Lok:

 

jones jr would have beat calzaghe down if they fought when both were at their peaks. either that or calzaghe would have cowered like the rest and jones jr would have coasted to a 12-0 decision.

 

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/023DG5wl95M" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

For sure. But that's no insult to Calzaghe (who I didn't like)

 

Jones would have beat Calzaghe prime for prime, which I've always said, but it wouldn't have been a shut out. Calzaghe gives him a fight and wins some rounds.

 

If by some you mean zero I agree totally.

 

Leonard's win over Duran is about as relevant as Tarver's win over Jones Jr. Just because Duran was able to fall back on technical ability in later years and continue to have some modicum of success, unlike Jones Jr (who just got knocked out again and again), doesn't mean he wasn't physically past it.

DeJesus' win is more impressive because he beat a physically prime Duran, and didn't have to be a punk at the negotiating table, then run like hell and act like a clown in a 24x24' ring to do it.

 

Well I don't believe that would be the case. It wouldn't be a shutout. It's your opinion though so I'll respectfully disagree. Doesn't make much difference either way as we both think he'd lose.

 

Here we Go w/the Built-In BULLSHIT Excuses that Only Duran Gets the Luxury of Using:bs:...

Roy Jones was 35 Years of Age when Tarver Beat him & had Shown Signs of Slippage a Couple Years PRIOR to that Bout...How Old was Duran when he Fought Leonard???...Duran Made a SEAMLESS Transition from Lightweight to Welter, w/ZERO Signs of Slippage...

The FUNNIEST Thing is How Duran Fans UNIVERSALLY Rate the Leoanard Bout as his CAREER BEST PERFORMANCE, yet in the Next Breath, Ya'll Actually Expect to Get Away w/the Notion that he was Somehow "Past Prime" in the IMMEDIATE RE???...That's a Level of BULLSHIT that Permeates Thru Laptops & Computers Screens Across the World...

Another Bit of BULLSHIT...REED has Heard Duran Fans CRITICIZE the DeJesus Win as NOT Being Meaningful Since it was a NON-Title Fight ABOVE 135...So Which is it???...

As for Leonard's Negotiation Tactics, Duran Could have Very Simply Said NO to Everyone of Leonard's Demands...& if he was Ill Prepared to Fight the Immediate RE, he Could've Very Easily Gotten "Injured"...Instead, Duran agREED to Leonard's Terms, Took the Fight & Got Embarrassingly MINDFUCKED for the Entire World to See...

It's Actually PATHETIC how U Duran Jizz Slurpers Give this Cat Every Single BENEFIT of the Doubt...As if he was the Perfect Fighting Machine, Incapable of LOSING a Fight...Sorry, but he Lost PLENTY of them...



REED:bs:

 

Past prime is irrelevant.

REED you know as well as I do Duran wasn't at his best in the rematch.

You don't have to be past prime to not be at your best.

Similar story with Roy, against Ruiz no one was saying he was shot or even really past prime, he looked good.

In his very next fight he looked pretty crap, and continued to do so thereafter.

With Roy it was from the muscle loss, with Duran it was from balooning up, partying too much, and not training as well as he should have.

Either way Duran was FAR from his best against Leonard in the rematch.

When they were both at their best in a normal size ring, Duran took him to school.