Fantastic Fights of the Century (video)

No, this is about Mencia affirming 30G's claim.

 

dsimon writes:

:bears: :bears:

I would say don't waste your breath. 3OG, but don't risk carple tunnel syndrome on the idiocy of Jawz and Strange love on this particular issue.

 

dsimon writes:

Cupey to be fair Sanders is a pretty good Golfer. ::

 

dsimon writes:

Good luck getting Jawz to make sense on this issue! Many wiser than I have tried repeatedly to deconstruct the lack of logic Jawz applies to this issue and to no availe.

 

None of the punches that ever dropped Joe Louis would knock down Wladimir Klitschko.

Nobody ever said Joe Louis wasn't a great fighter, Jaws called you guys out for saying Wladimir Klitschko had a glass chin and JoeLouis would find it, when clearly Klitschko's ability to take a punch is much higher than Joe Louis.

You guys say how many times was Louis KOed, has Wladimir ever been knocked out?? No. If Joe fought in today's era he would've TKOed in many fights that were allowed to go on.

And Nobleart...

what does coming back to win have to do with chins?? Tyson clearly has a great chin, its mental toughness that he is lacking if anything.

While there is a small amount of guys from the 1940's who could compete in today's boxing it is almost certainly not the heavyweights. If you think Jack Johnson could defeat or come close to defeating David Tua you are a fool.

Jesse Owens could probably beat Maurice Greene in the 100M sprint too right??

 

1. How many skilled 220 LBS fighters did Joe Louis EVER fight? In fact I would say Joe Louis never fought a fight with comparable offensive abilities to Corrie Sanders...a 6'4 225 LBS lefty with one punch power. A rarity in boing history.

2. Neither Sanders nor Brewster knocked out Klitschko, both fights were TKOs. If Joe Louis fought in the modern era at least 2 of his fights wouldve been TKO losses for him.

 

I was somewhat respecting the opinion of this post until I read - "If you think Jack Johnson could defeat or come close to defeating David Tua you are a fool."

WTF Johnson was a tremendous boxer , about 6'2 and over 210lbs ..
He had stamina out his ass ....
Why would you think he would not be able to handle Tua ?

 

dsimon writes:

This is the other big logical flaw in this argument: All sports evolve the same way, and boxers are therefore better today.

1) If we had been playing baseball since the stoneage then I doubt baseball players would be better today than 50 years ago. We have been fistfighting since the stone age at least... The anatomical points of how to throw a punch harder are not new to human beings.

2) The rules have changed so much in boxing that it is a different sport. More watered down if anything. Fighters today do not have to be nearly as good as fighters of old. So where is the evolution of the sport? In football guys are better know because the sport is more complicated. They have to be smarter, bigger and stronger. They are athletes, where as before they were bruisers. Boxers today have to fight less rounds with bigger gloves.... you see a problem here?

3) Not everything evolves. We had hydrocarbon engines in the 30's that could do everything a car engine (minus the other engineering factors) could do today and that was made so that it could be maintained indefinitely. Yes cars are better today, but for other reasons.

4) Boxing had better trainers and better apprenticeship programs. Fighters had to have more skills. Today's fighters are primarily athletes and only fighters second to that. The old fighters were fighters first, they thought like fighters and boxing was more related to real combat.

These are just a few things.

 

Let me get this straight. Louis would get knocked down, recuperate quickly, get back up and kick your ass = shitty chin

Tyson would get knocked down or hurt.............would never recover.....and always go on to lose, get KO'd or quit = great chin

Either I'm reading this wrong or Joe Louis had some amazing defensive abilities that Mike Tyson could only dream about.

Jack Johnson didn't fight in the 1940's. I'll ask you the same question I asked Jaws and didn't get an answer for. What do present Heavy's do that 40's era Heavyweights didn't do? :dunno:

 

The first patent for a color television was awarded in 1904.

 

Although he had his last professional bout in 1938, Johnson did have a number of exhibitions in the 1940s.

 

Having just read Unforgivable Blackness I am going to have to respectfully disagree.

Johnson weighed no more than 208 LBS in his prime, and on top of that was not only nearly knocked out by Stanley Ketchel (a middleweight), but he was also knocked out by Joe Choynski (another middleweight) and refused a rematch for the rest of his career.

While Johnson had great defensive skills, alot of it involved imposing his "size" and clinching his opponent, and using his left hand to parry his weaker opponents blows and delivering his lethal right uppercut.

David Tua would bull right through Johnson and his punches would be twice as hard as any Johnson has/had felt before. And Johnson was not a mover either, he was a very physical fighter and sorry but that would absolutely not work against David Tua. Many a fighter stronger then Johnson (with better chins to boot) were annhialated trying to get tough with Tua.

 

He was fuckin 60 years old in 1940 ... ::

 

I think this is purely a semantics argument. Your definition of chin is different then that of mine or Jaws'.

Chin is the ability to TAKE a punch, and the punches that floored Joe Louis would hardly put a dent in Tyson. I am not arguing that Tyson was tougher or had better recouperative abilities, BUT punches that befelled Louis would not have dropped Tyson. Therefore Tyson's chin > Louis' chin. Sound good??

 

The guy had something like 130 fights... Most of which were under fucked up circumstances .. Shit happens the more times you roll the dice ...

 

I can assure you, if David Tua fought 100 middleweights he would not have a KO loss.

 

Wladimir's could take better punches to the chin than Louis? Based on what? Being pummeled by Ross Purity? Being knockdown 100 times by Samuel Peter? This is speculation. All we do know is that Wladimir has been stopped and dropped by C level fighters.

Cupey

 

Wrong. Johnson wasn't "nearly knocked out" against Ketchel. He was knocked down, and played 'possum, taking a nine-count to get Ketchel to open up. And the Choynski fight took place when Johnson was no more than an amateur. Johnson didn't give him a rematch because Choynski retired at about the same time Johnson hit his prime.

It's obvious you know little about the era. What more do you know about Johnson's career?

Based on what? His 0-1 record against middleweights?

Also, one big difference between Louis and Tua is that when Louis got hit, he didn't hide in his shell for the rest of the fight, the way Tua does. Louis wouldn't have fought like as big a bitch as Tua did against Louis.

 

When Joe Louis got cracked on the chin by a 200+ LBS, it almost always meant he was going down.

Only after BOMBS from 230+ LBS fighter has Wladimir even seen the canvas(barring a very flash knockdown vs. Steve Pannell)

It is a matter of physics Cupey, nothing else. a 245 LBS in shape guy can generally take a better shot than a 195 LBS man...period. If Joe Louis was breathed on by Sam Peter he would be seeing stars.

When you are dropped and nearly stopped by Two Ton Tony Galento (the poorest Butterbean impression of the olden days) you do not have a chin as sturdy as Klitschko.

 

Exposed!

90% of Johnson's defense was his hands. You've obviously never seen him fight.

 

i know stupidity is like race, it can't be wiped away, but my goodness there are some slanted and idiotic motherfuckers trollin this board.

 

This is not true. Choynski repeatedly challenged Johnson and was not given a rematch. Jack Johnson ALSO ducked Sam Langford. Against Ketchel he played possum?? Where do you get this bullshit?? Someone obviously has done some faulty editing to wikipedia. Against Johnson he agreed to let the fight go to a draw but was dropped hard and got up and KOed Ketchel.

When did David Tua fight a middleweight?? Certainly you don't mean Chris Byrd, a former heavyweight champion who weighed a solid 215 (bigger than Jack Johnson even, how bout that?)

Louis was never hit by near as big a puncher as Lennox Lewis so it is purely speculation what he would do if he got caught. My guess is be knocked the fuck out. You know, what usually happens when a 250 LBS man hits a 195 LBS one right on the chin.

I know just as much about the era as anybody else who wasn't around during the time. Anybody who thinks because they have read a book with a different account of what happened, or an article by Nat Fleischer, that they somehow know more than someone else who has read numerous books on the same subject is an idiot.

"His 0-1 record vs. 215 LBS solid middleweights"
ahahahaha stupidest thing I have ever read on these boards

 

If Tua only weight 180lbs at the time , I think you might want to think again ...

 

Yeah , fighters that weight 230lbs that could have afforded to lose 20lbs if they were in peak condition .. ::

 

don't be so hard on yourself. You'll get wiser. just keep reading the boards :tease:

 

90%?? Is that a fact??

He was very popular for his ability to parry punches, but when in doubt clinched and pushed people around with his superior size (didn't get the nickname Galveston GIANT for nothing)

And even if this was true...how the fuck do you know?? You've seen as many Johnson fights in real-time speed, as you have seen pussy aka zero.

 

And if he was 5'3 I would think again also. But the fact is he was over 225 when he was solid. And at his prime weight would NEVER lose to someone weighing 160 LBS like Johnson did...let alone by knockout.

 

But 20 LBS lighter would not hit as hard. You think Lamon Brewster or Corrie Sanders could weigh 200 LBS?? That would be sacrificing their power for endurance. While it would help them become lesser fighters, it certainyl would hurt their ability to punch.

 

Did you just call Chris Byrd a "solid" 215 lber. Guy is softer then a cupcake. If Jack Johnson went on the Chris Byrd diet he'd be a 245 lb'er.

David Tua?

The guy had the lateral movement of a tree. Why is his name even being brought up.

Here's a couple names. Max and Buddy Baer. Why don't you guys go look up their sizes and whether they hit hard or not.

 

Yes , but Johnson was only 180 at the time ...

Maybe we could get Tua when he was young enough to be 180 and throw him in with experienced Middle weights and then put your theory to the test ....
If you want to go by your standards , Johnson was never KO'd by a Middle weight when he weighed well over 200lbs either ..