Fantastic Fights of the Century (video)

hahah Chris Byrd is softer than a cupcake?? I suppose Jack Johnson was a mountain of muscle compared to him right?? :dunno:

Max Baer hit hard as fuck...Too bad he put close to no power shots on Joe Louis and was brutalized. Same goes for a guy like Buddy Baer who apparently who have heard nothing of.

A 6'6 240 LBS (giant) who bullrushed his opponents and crushed them on pure size. No chin, no speed. Dropped Louis in their dubious first fight, was knocked out in the rematch in one round. The one flush punch in both fights combined he landed put Louis on his ass.

Neither of those guys hit nearly as hard, have nearly as good a chin, or are nearly as physically strong as David Tua.

Louis complained of how physically strong Rocky Marciano was...who think he could handle Tua??

 

Brewster is a 210 lb fighter fighting in the 230's ...

James Toney is a 200lb fighter fighting in the 230's ....

Your body is stronger when its pulling around extra worthless weight ?
I don't believe this to be true ....
IMO Ruiz was no weaker when he fought Jones. His overall muscle mass remained the same. Toney is still the 200lb version that fought Jirov - he is just fatter and slower because of his weight. His muscle mass is the same. He would have been better off fighting the guys he has been fighting if he still weighed 200lbs instead of having the burden of 35 extra pounds ..

 

Not to mention Bryd ALWAYS states he could easily still make Cruiser weight and even might move down ...
That is far from a solid 215lb fighter .... A solid 215lb fighter would only be able weight 203/205 dehydrated ..... Not 190 ....

 

Isn't that based more on genetics or body type though?

I see these fighters like Fedor, or those guys on "Strongest Man" competitions and they always seem to carry "extra" weight but are strong as an ox. Some of the "chubbier" competitors seem to outmuscle the really cut guys in those competitions even though on paper they weigh almost the same.

Something about that body build... :dunno:

 

Its only fitting that someone who knows nothing about boxing oversees this gang of retards.

Is anyone arguing that Joe Louis had a better chin than Klitschko, cause thats stupid. You know in keeping with that I think Arturo Gatti could beat Floyd Mayweather if they fought.

Wait, did someone actually say that in seriousness? I wonder who that was...the claims and arguments presented in this thread are proof that science will never cure retardation.

LOL at dsimon's drivel. Not an ounce of ur evolution nonsense is factually based. How bout facts like athletes are bigger, stronger, and faster.

How about facts like world records being shattered constantly. The oldest olympic record still in existence is Bob Beamon's long jump...from 1968. What about all the great marks from Owens and other fabulous athletes of the olden eras. Oh thats right, they pale in comparison.

Simon all you posted was drivel. "Boxing had better trainers and better apprenticeship programs. Fighters had to have more skills. Today's fighters are primarily athletes and only fighters second to that. The old fighters were fighters first, they thought like fighters and boxing was more related to real combat"

"If we had been playing baseball since the stoneage then I doubt baseball players would be better today than 50 years ago. We have been fistfighting since the stone age at least... The anatomical points of how to throw a punch harder are not new to human beings"

unsubstantiated and biased.

You old time loving faggots will serve the earth well when you die. That is all.

 

Exposed!

That story is a myth - one of many invented by Johnson that were exposed later on - and anyone who's seen the fight knows it's not true.

No. Something like that would be impossible to calculate. ANYONE who's seen him fight knows that most of Johnson's defense was blocks and parries.

Most of his defense was based on blocking and parrying. ANYONE who's seen him fight knows that. You obviously haven't.

And actually, Johnson was famous for fighting larger men. He was only 6'0.25". Here are the heights of some of the people he faced who were taller than he was:

• Victor McLagen: 6'3"
• Peter Felix: 6'3.5"
• Hank Griffin: 6'1"
• Jack Jeffries: 6'1'
• Joe Butler: 6'1"
• Denver Ed Martin: 6'3.5"
• Fred Russell: 6'4"
• Joe Kennedy: 6'2"
• Jim Jeffries: 6'2.5"
• Jim Jeffords: 6'4"
• "Bombadier" Billy Wells: 6'3"
• Tom Cowler: 6'1.5"
• "Big" Bill Hartwell: 6'3"
• Bearcat Wright: 6'1"
• Dynamite Jackson: 6'1"
• Floyd Johnson: 6'1"
• Jim Johnson: 6'3"
• Jess Willard: 6'5" or more

Can you spell "exposed"? You watched some PBS documentary, and think you deserve to have an opinion on this?

I've been married for seven years. Save your childish insults for other pre-teens. There's considerable film of Johnson's career, and many of the fights have been re-sped to normal speed.

Louis was opening up, you dumbass. Tua, on the other hand, hides in his shell once he gets hit. And calling Louis-B.Baer I dubious? Louis knocked him down four times and Baer's manager didn't want his fighter to suffer anymore, so he put up an act about complaining that the final knockdown was late, which it really wasn't. It was a little after the bell, but it wasn't blatant.

Being strong is only a minor aspect of being a good boxer. You need speed, timing, defense, balance and a whole bunch of other things. Being overweight, you lose to much.

 

Wow, that's some deep fuckin' analysis. Way to fall back on the ever useful bigger, faster, stronger argument with nothing to base it on other then insults.

I love the Jesse Owens vs. Carl Lewis, Maurice Greene arguments. Yeah, that would apply if they punched each others faces in for a living.

You my friend have just officially joined Rubio as part of the "cunt" club.

Now sit down at the buffet and you can smash each other over the head with rocks and such.


Oh, and as far as Joe Louis having a better chin then Wlad.....................I believe you're the only one who brought that up. 30G said that Louis would eventually get to Klit's chin.........he didn't say ones chin was better then the other. Maybe he's just saying Louis is "better" then Klit and would get to his chin before Klit got to Louis's.

Wlad is such a passive fighter when he feels somebody elses power I don't understand how this could be out of the realm of possibility. Louis knocked out lots of guys over 230 lbs..

 

Regardless of whether you claim these things are myths or not. They are in more than one book I have read about Jack Johnson. Taller does not equal bigger, and once again you don't the nickname GIANT because u are a small man fighting bigger ones.

Fights have been re-sped?? Source??

Does your mail order bride approve of you being online 24/7 making up multiple personalities?

I've seen all of the weird sped up fights that u have seen and have seen many many clinches. While I have read he was all about hand blocks and parries I take it as revisionist history and go with what I have seen.

Oh and haahahahhahaahhahah for the man who said stop using boxrec then came up with some obscure fighters heights...of the top of your head right?

 

dsimon writes:

Exactly!:bears: :bears:

Ketchel knocked Johnson down and embarrassed him. That was the extent of it as witnessed by Johnson making a bracelet out of Ketchel's teeth subsequent to the flash knockdown.

Tua couldn't fight for five rounds, much less 15 rounds. I like Choke and all but what a load of crap comparing Tua to Louis.

One could perhaps make the case that Tua could knock Louis down with a hook under the best of circumstances. Louis... knockdowns and all protected his crown against all types of fighters. Incidentally Carnera was also not the dumb beast people make him out to be. I am not so sure he couldn't hurt Klitschko and if he did last past the 5th round with Klit klit would keel over from exhaustion... Canera had a fantastic work rate for a big man.

 

dsimon writes:

People did a lot of grappling back then Choke. And it was done intelligently the same way it is done today in combatives... to neutralize and to get position on somoene. Fighters just don't know how to fight from the inside anymore. There are exceptions like Hopkins who is a throwback to that era.

 

dsimon writes:

too bad you can't refute it. If somoene were banned for stupidity on this thread you would be entitled to a long vacation in Tahiti:: ::.

 

dsimon writes:

I have watched many of Johnson's fights and watched him grapple with people. I have never seen him pushing somoene around with brute force. Usually what I see is him moving his feet and controlling them using leverage in a way that when Helio Gracie used it he could actually neutralize Kimmura for a long time. And Kimmura was a lot stronger than Helio!

Choke watch his feet when he is pushing, his feet are moving and he is invariably setting up for a punch, or moving off a punching line of the opponent so he won't get tagged full force. This is subtlety at work.

What people fail to realize is the subtlety in how the old guys used leverage and infighting. Yes it looks like pushing just like the Gracies look like they are dry humping, but that type of pushing is what helped Evander beat Tyson: By pushing Tyson straight back on his heels (and an elbow or two) Holyfield totally neutralized Tyson's fearful punch. Sometimes you don't see all the things that a guy is doing. Hopkins did the same sort of things. His infighting allowed him to control and dominate and all people kept saying is he is a dirty fighter but there was nothing dirty about it.

 

It's just a nickname. About 20 fighters of the era used the nickname "Giant." The point is, he did not mostly faced smaller fighters. Many of the fighters who were 5'10" outweighed him. You were wrong, and you were exposed.

A good number of classic fights were re-sped when they were transfered to video-tape. Really, it's only a matter of changing the reel speed.

You're confusing me with someone else.

Clinching was common in fights of the era - not the John Ruiz type of clinching, but getting inside to trade shots, like what Harry Greb, Fritzie Zivic and Jake LaMotta did. Johnson had EXCELLENT blocking abilities, and he didn't clinch any more than the average fighter of the era.

No, I knew that during the "White Hope" era, Johnson fought primarily against fighters who were bigger than he was. I used the Cyber Boxing Zone to quickly get their names; I could have easily named five or so off the top of my head, but it was more fun to completely expose you as the idiot you are by naming nearly 20. Really all you know about Johnson is that his more politically-correct nickname had "giant" in it. At the time, he was often called "Galveston Jack," or "Bad Nigger" Jack Johnson.

 

another great piece of logic.

The easter bunny is real. People had more facial hair in the 11th century than any other era.

prove me wrong

 

The only thing that stopped Helio from getting thrown very early in his fight with Kimura was that he was stalling and using the gi...I have played many judo blackbelts my size and was able to stall for a minute or two before they got ippon due to me holding onto their gis much like Master Helio did against Kimura.

But besides that good post.

Although Hopkins was a dirty motherfucker hahaha

 

That's a very good point!!! I also noticed that alot people think that getting dropped = Chinny. No! Not getting up after flash knock downs = : chinny, bad conditioning, ect. Joe fought sometimes nine fights in less than 2 months. His chances of touching the canvas ratio/kd is skewed. Factor in 6oz gloves and longer fights (12rounds plus); oh and not to mention "Joe Louis came and sit right here one day. I said Joe how old was you when you fought Rock?.......... Joe said he was 131 yrs. old when he fought Rock!!!!" :laughing:

 

dsimon writes:

In truth that is pretty much all Helio did ::. When did Kimura break is arm? was that another fight?

 

No it was the same fight. While Helio was much much weaker (135 LBS very skinny) vs Kimura (5'6" 180 with a bench press of over 400 LBS!) , he was still according the Kimura a blackbelt judo player. Kimura actually choked out Helio early in the fight but Helio didn't tap and went out, and woke up and continued to grapple. Before the fight Helio had told his brother Carlos that he would not tap out no matter what. But when Kimura broke his arm with an omoplata (now known as a kimura) Carlos threw in the towel.

Although it is the same principle of leverage...Without the gi, Helio wouldn't have been able to stand more than 10 seconds with Kimura IMO.

 

dsimon writes:

We have enough evidence to look at older fighters Jaws we don't have enough evidence to know with certaintly who would win mythical match ups.

If you look for things that a fighter looks for you will definitely see things that are very subtle that the older guys did. Choke used a good example about holding the Gi for leverage against a stronger guy in Judo. You may see two guys that look like they are dancing with each other and not realize that one guy is not getting dominated because he has his thumb knuckle in the other guy's cateroid sinus because of a very particular grip on the guys Gi.

It looks like some guys are flailing away but sometimes their footwork, the use of the body in the clinch, etc is neutralizing the opponent. The silly looking stance in the infancy of boxing is another example. It makes it impossible for the guy to walk in and blitzkrieg you because your lead hand is right in his face and you just extend an inch and the jab is thrown. Tyson or Dempsey would have had a hell of a time walking in and crushing a guy who knew how to fight well in this era.

You have to have a fighter's eye to see some of the things going on but there is a lot more to viewing the classical fighters and comparing them on size and film speed.

 

idiotic. The easter bunny is real, you can't prove me wrong. How many people hide colored eggs each year?

You have to look at this like a squirrel

 

dsimon writes:

Thats true.

 

dsimon writes:

Face it junior you don't know what to look for. Sly could teach you a thing about the square circle and the track for that matter:: .

There are a lot of silly tantrums you have on line. Nobody can logically refute the material that results from these tantrums, does that give you some measure of solace::.

 

I'm just trying to compare the claims you idiots have made with creations of my own. Face it, The easter bunny is real. After all, Tony the tiger said that the easter bunny was tough, obviously that makes it tougher than King Kong

 

What kind of track are you talking about?? Del Mar?? Churchill Downs??

Surely you don't mean track and field? ::

 

I don't see why anyone would listen to Winner by Choke after his exposure in this thread.

 

Wolf! Wolf!

from now on you are a wolf

 

Is that a reference from Immortal Beloved?

 

I don't speak wolf

 

You're not so great with English, either.

 

hahahah easy there troll.

nobody was exposed here nearly as bad as you were exposed in ringside: srl.

just because you can look up facts on boxrec about 6'3 Bad Bill Barnes doesn't mean you "exposed" anybody.

especially a poster such as myself who knows many other posters who can verify my boxing knowledge unlike you and your precious search engine skills.