frank shamrock thinks most strikers in mma suck.

The funny thing is, no one disputed that. What was disputed was that having to move your head, block a kick, defend a takedown, was a bit more complex than what he wants to believe. :notallthere:

What is funny, is he doesn't get any of it. ::
But don't tell him, hopefully he keeps posting, its good reading::

 

thank you. why cant some people get this into their heads? funny thing is, he brought up the example of crocop being ko'd by a kick to the head to someone defending against leg kicks:laughing:

for defending against the body and head theres so much more to learn. i still want to know the many ways of defending against leg kicks but he literally sprawled the question:laughing:

 

without a doubt, the best week ever on this board, and I owe it all to you:cheer:

 

Take downs set up submissions, jabs set up power punches. I understand what he means.

 

everybody did Gatti, well not EVERYBODY, I guess::

 

i'll explain the differences, the person who initiates the takedown isnt guaranteed to win by submission. forgot the name of that guy in your sig profile, but i know he's subbed fighters who initiate the takedown (on his back) and he's primarily a striker. what i'm saying is i dont think its easier to initiate a submission with a takedown than it is to set-up a KO with a jab. especially if your opponent is equally as good as you are. at k1 dynamite mighty mo was subbed by a submission wrestler that he took down.

 

you don't have to explain the differences, I know the differences, I am just stating that I see where he is coming from.


It's Gegard Mousasi, btw. Most fights I've seen of him he won from the back.

 

yes thats what i said. is he a black belt in JJ? he's subbed a lot of bjj black belts i've noticed. i find that a little strange considering he has a striking background.

 

with all kidding aside, I would agree with everything said here. I think for the most part, we were comparing apples and oranges. But it was all in fun right? If you get the chance watch Mousasi vs Manhoeff, fun fight to watch. That is if you haven't seen it yet.

 

anyone here ever been in with someone who can kick hard to the leg? checking kicks is not easy.

couple years back i was kickboxing with a friend of mine who was just learning and we were both horrible (had maybe 1 month of training) i was about 128-135 range he was about 160.

it seemed so easy to block but once we were really fighting blocking one was very difficult, because it was followed by a punch or clinch attempt.

long story short i was getting the worst of it and landed a heavy leg kick and it was over. he checked it a split second too slow and that was it.

the only guy who saw ripped this guy for crumbling until the next day when his leg was all jacked.

picture:



point in case on a really hard kick, you need flawless timing and strong legs to check...people make it sound like its dribbling a basketball.

 

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=X-0YC_BKSUA

 

dont forget about many of ramon dekkers fights, as he was primarily a boxer with vicious elbows who dominated kickboxing/muay thai for awhile.

IMO top level boxers are just a higher level of athlete. hence the reason they would be able to switch over easier than vice versa.

i guess it just depends on the fighters.

 

Well, you really touched on the theme of this thread. While the idea of defending leg kicks seems simple, it's not as easy as it sounds.

Personally, and this is going back almost 10 years, I hated checking leg kicks. It still hurts. I tried to move away or into them to reduce the damage.

But even more imporatantly, when standing and defending in MMA, the threat of a leg kicks, take downs, etc make it more difficult to defend than strictly punching.

By the way, I can almost feel the pain from that picture. Damn.

 

this was my main point, thanks trplsec

 

dont forget mike zambidis.

Frank expressed two things there as I read him. 1. That boxing is an intrical part of successful MMA, and 2. That you need that training, and you just adjust it for integrating the other ranges.

When you do that of course, it doesn’t stop being “Boxing”, which is unique in the old breakdown of differing standup fighting styles (Karate, Kung Fu, etc.). Stances adjust in boxing as anyone who knows boxing will tell you, and there in fact is no one “classical boxing stance” that boxing depends on in order to be called “boxing”.

Jonny Rhodes and Pat Smith showed us all by UFC 2 what a boxing trained set of hands could do and that’s why all the MMA training centers use it today, adjusted to the job you have to do under any rules, and all the fights start off boxing…. just watch sylvia against Fedor..

MMA fans who rag on boxing had to come through some other thing to become fans. Lots of them strait from diapers or comics, or WWE, whatever.Anyone who came to MMA through Boxing like I did would know boxing when he saw it. Anyone coming to MMA any other way, most likely wouldn’t.

Adjusting your style and tool kit for a rules change is pretty obvious.There’s things in BJJ, Combat Sambo, Judo, Freestyle, Greco-Roman, Muay Thai, etc. that have to be adjusted for MMA too. Plenty. Everybody takes whatever pieces of these things they can, and many fighters have a base. You don’t hear anyone posting “That’s not BJJ” do you?You can think about why that might be.