Heavy weight division, what a joke!

Technically it's a duopoly

 

Because now you are spoiled for choice when it comes round to hating people!!!

You have twice as many chances as a Klitschko being beaten!!!

 

Nothing wrong with having two kings every now and then. At least each is dominant.

If another Tyson comes along to clean out the dvision then by all means I'll be supporting him but until then..I'd settle for the dominance of the Klits. They are big/strong bad men and I'm a fan! artie:

 

I can't say i'm a fan of the brothers but i don't hate on them either. They go out and get the job done every time out. They also show in shape. What a concept! Sure the heavyweight division is shit, but imagine it without them.

 

I rewatched the fight in better quality,.. and it WAS boring,.. but I think they're BOTH to blame for that,..and I thought Emmanuel's screaming was pretty ironic, this is YOUR protoge,.. you created this,.. and you wont teach him anything daring so what do you expect?.. Wlad doesn't throw combinations, he won't go to the body, and he CAN'T counterpunch at all, at all..

 

Compare his instructions in the Peter fight with those in the Sultan fight.....
......Manny needs to make his mind up.

 

True, Manny is well aware of the cameras and says what he thinks people want to hear. He's not been the most consistent with how Wlad "should" fight.

I do think he's right that Wlad should be more aggressive if his opponent isn't offering any resistance though. Obviously he shouldn't swing for the fences but the KO should be on his mind.

 

Do you know what I saw in the last round?... Wlad threw a left hook to the body,.. I spat my coffee out,... not in my life time, it was very rude.

I can understand why people get the shits with this monotonous form of offense,.. it's interesting,.. usually boring fighters,.. are the strict counter-punching, no power having bitches who spend most of the time running around the perimetre,.. Wlad is not on the 'defensive' spectrum,.. he's on the aggression spectrum,... but it is the absolute worst form of aggression possible.. seemingly nothing but the jab. Still,....... he can't take all the blame,.. when his power so often discourages his opponents so badly they freeze into a cowering defensive shell,.. his opponent wont initiate enough pressure and action of thier own,.. so it's just a one way street full of jabs,....jab......jab......jab..............*skip back, skip forward* jab.......jab.......jab........

 

Tua's already had 3 shots at a title. Give him a chance? He's already had 3 and lost 3, I can't see him being 4th time lucky i'm sorry! :nono:

 

Wlad's jab, when it lands, sounds like a telephone directory for the greater Beijing area being dropped from the top of the Eiffel tower into a vat of triple cream.

It is a most restrictive form of debilitating offensive punching.

He doesn't do anything, but he doesn't have to, because, in accordance with the rules of boxing, once that jab is on point, the rest is moot.

His jab is a bazooka, but it is also the cats whiskers, setting up that right hand which has hurt and dropped almost every fighter it has landed on.

KauKi: here is a vid of how Wlad can throw short punches

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WHAT!!??!!!???! :atu:

Leave clever descriptives to true writers punk! ::

 

By the way I'm a huge Klitschko fan if people haven't figured that out already...both brothers.

Wlad...IMO..is one of the TOP 3 best offensive fighters in heavyweight history: Tyson and Louis being the other two.

By offensive I mean...punishment delivery system.

Somewhat like Thomas Hearns, if Wlad had a great chin and great stamina he'd be virtually unbeatable.

 

I am the best. I ammmmm the best.

 

Wlad has indeed demonstrated the ability to deliver punishment especially earlier in his career. Now it is difficult to say that though since he hardly ever attacks. Both his jab and his right cross are in my opinion in the top-3 of the division history.

What Wlad has done since Manny came to coach him is that he has removed every move that is not absolutely necessary out of his game plan. That means, bodyshots, hooks, uppercuts, long combinations. What some people understand wrong is that he has less skill than somebody who uses all these. What actually has happened is that Wlad only uses the techniques that are safe and bring him the victory. It can be boring at times, but as of late his results are difficult to argue with

 

Absolutely, you get the impression Manny often is looking out for himself when he perceives his fighter isn't looking too hot....I vaguely remember him shouting at Jermain Taylor when he was stinking it out against Cory Spinks that he told them they should have chosen Miranda (obviously this was after Pavlik had made Miranda look like a scrub on the undercard)

 

That is typical of Manny.

Nothing is happening at center ring, and Manny is babbling to Lampley about that time when Tommy slipped on a used tampon outside Kronk, then BANG someone gets floored and Manny starts screaming "Oh! Oh! Dats what I said was gonna happen..there it is..that's what I said was happening".

When in fact he had said no such thing.

 

Absolutely

MTF :laughing:

 

:nono::nono:Definitely:nono::nono:

 

The HW Division is cursed by a long lasting Lennox Lewis hangover. Lewis owned the division and was clearly the top HW in the minds of fans and experts.

Now the division is splintered even if it you narrow it down to a two way split between Wlad and Vitiali.

And to make matters worse, the two guys considered atop the division now are a step down from the previous generation's champion in Lennox Lewis.

Lewis, as a fairly aged HW, defeated the brother generally consider the better of the two. While it was a close, hard fought bout, Lewis won and then retired. He was, even at the end, better than the Klitschkos.

It's unfortunate but the HW division no longer has a singular face beneath the crown that is clearly the best. The Tyson era followed by the Holyfield era followed by the Lewis is being followed by the "One of those white guys from Russia" era. And it's just not very interesting.

 

Thank you for your measured contribution. I am glad you dedicated such time to addressing the matter of how Vitali was relatively inexperienced and had almost no training in preparation for Lewis. Your forthright regurgitation of how Lewis was old, tired, fat etc sheds new light on what I thought was a closed-case.

 

'Somehow' I'd forgotten,.. it's been years Irishman,... years.

 

The Heavyweight division is underrated.

You have two dominant champions. That's GOOD.

Joe Louis fought a bunch of bums for years...but the division was still good since it had a good champion.

For the most part....A division is as good as it's champion IMO...

 

I didn't call Lewis fat, tired, or old. I said relatively aged, which is exactly what he was and not a regurgitation of anything. It's called being fact-based. It was a fact that he was almost 37. It was a fact that he weighed more in the Vitali fight than for any fight in his career. See, facts, I know they can be irratating.

And speaking of fact-based, how was Vitali relatively inexperienced exactly? Unless you use the term 'relatively' in a very finite method, the idea is horseshit.

Vitali had defended the WBO title 3 times. Vitali had fought 3 or 4 top ten heavyweights. Vitali had 33 fights under his belt. All of this happened BEFORE he stepped in the ring with Lewis.

I guess my definition of 'relatively inexperienced' must be skewed or something because I reserve if for guys like Mike Tyson fighting for the title at 20 years old after only a year and a half of experience as a pro. Or I would use it for a guy like Evander Holyfield when fighting Dwight Qawi for the Cruiserweight title in only his 12th pro fight. But I damn sure wouldn't use it for an almost 32 year old Vitali Klitschsko. That would just be moronic. Hell, I think the guy also had over 200 amateur fights.

But regardless, the best version of Lennox beats the best version of Wlad or Vitali in my opinion, and that is really the point.

 

I'm a Lennox Lewis fan and this is a nice summary....but like most information it's merely being economical with the truth.

I saw that fight.

Vitali was winning and the momentum was with him. lewis was spurred on when he saw how bad the cut was but if it wasn't for the cut, based on the fight's momentum, Vitali would have won. The Klit was ahead on points at the time of the stoppage from what I can remember anyway.

In any event...that's not to say that Vitali is better than Lennox. Lennox was certainly getting older and he was a little overweight for that fight.

However

That fight can't be used to suggest that lennox was better than him either.

 

great point! that straw weight division was good during Finito Lopez's reign.

 

The best version of Lennox arguably beats every other heavyweight in history...though. Lennox had physical gifts almost beyond compare in the history of the division. He'd have given even a prime Ali all he could handle.

 

::
I guess my point is...it's the CHAMPION that bring excitement to a division.

Until Holyfield came along..Tyson was basically dealing with a bunch of Average heavies..YET...the excitement was there simply BECAUSE the champion was good.

 

Lewis was behind by 2 points. But anything other than saying Lewis won is speculation.

With Lewis, anything COULD have happened from that point forward.

 

Exactly my point.

 

I agree,.. but mythical matchups are as silly as p4p lists,..it's all fantasy, and nothing is a lock,.. upsets happen, styles make fights,..and so it is only my opinion, that Lewis 'could' defeat any pro-boxer in history, if I were to pick one fighter,.. Lewis would be it.