Is Cain Velasquez as GOOD as he Looked OR, is Brock Lesnar as BAD as he Looked???...

Here's a quote from 2007 by Tim Sylvia, who trained with Brock:

“I don’t think he’s going to have a future in MMA … He’s a baby. Don’t kick him [because] he doesn’t want to get hurt. He’s a helluva wrestler and he’s strong. But he can’t punch and doesn’t know how to kick. He can only go straight forward. He can’t survive as just a takedown guy.â€￾

 

Either way, he'll never find himself stretched on the mat with Ray Mercer standing over him, so hes been pretty sucessful as is.

 

I knew somebody would bring it up. Brock would smash Sylvia, but it doesn't make the comment any less valid.

 

Agreed, Sylvia's ability is not relevant, it's an accurate assessment of Brock.

 

Funny, but that quote is from 2007. Lesnar had zero MMA experience at that point. And now, 3 years later, he still looks as Sylvia described.

 

i think cain is very good, but let's see how he reacts when JDS lands some solid punches on him. i pick cain to win, but it's still a pick'em fight imo.

as for brock, it's been proven in the last two fights that his boxing defense sucks. he's also very vulnerable when he gets hit, but only when he has a big strong guy in front of him who's not scared to get close.

imo, the guy simply didn't 'evolve' as joe rogan would put it. and it's not like he's some young grasshopper either. at age 33, i highly doubt he'll improve. still, he's only the second or third best heavyweight in the world.

 

Yeah good point. And although we all see Brock as highly inexperienced, MMA differs from boxing in that you can learn it quick, as it's a newer sport, it doesn't require as much experience, and if anything guys that are joining the sport now that MMA is more polished and evolved can quickly get up to speed.

He does have a decent amount of MMA experience now, and yeah, he is the same, he hasn't become a well rounded MMA fighter.

He is a big, strong wrestler, with impressive strength and athleticism, but if he can't just outright overpower you, he's easy pickings as Cain showed.

 

It's MISleading to Call him "Easy Pickings", Mex...The END RESULT Looked like 'Easy Pickings', but the FACT is, Cain IGNORED 2 Powerful Knees @ the Start of the Fight, IMMEDIATELY Got Up from 2 Seperate Takedowns AND had to Deal w/Lesnar's Grappling Tactics Against the Cage...

It's NOT like Cain Walked Out & Dominated Lesnar w/ZERO Resistance, Every Minute & Second of the Fight...REED is STILL Amazed @ How those Kneelifts had ZERO Affect on Cain....



REED:mj:

 

Exactly. It's kind of like when Rahman knocked out Lewis. It didn't mean from that point forward guys were just going to be able to get in the ring and automatically beat Lewis. They still had to deal with his size and strengths.

The same with Lesnar. 90% of the opponents that Lesnar could possibly face don't get up from the first take down. Anyone that steps in the cage with Brock still has to deal with his size and strengths.

 

Of course, but that's kind of my point.

Lesnar is a huge, powerful brute, and he's just going to steamroll you if you can't handle his sheer strength etc.

I'm not saying "he is easy pickings" because clearly that's not true, what I said is IF he can't overpower you, which is of course a fairly big if, seeing as he is able to just manhandle most people, but if you can overcome his sheer power, then he doesn't have much else to offer to be honest.

 

Pac is the exception, not the rule. Look no further than Floyd and his highly touted undefeated record.

I don't get to watch MMA much and I don't find it a threat to boxing BUT if there is one part of this sport that boxing looks at with a jealous eye, it must be the attitude to losses. The way that boxing is currently structured, it caters to frontrunners and fighters unwilling to take the big tests.

I know that Lesnar earns scorn from some MMA heads due to his WWE background but you're talking about a guy that tested himself early and often against top guys in his chosen sport.

When was the last time we had a boxer like that?

 

Great point and it's an improved HW division overall. Cain is just a phenom and might end up being the best HW in the history of the sport. So being a potential second to Velasquez ain't too shabby.

 

So beating a 5-1 Brock gives you the potential for being the best ever. You are getting a little carried away here.

 

We agree on everything.

 

exactly that was a ridiculous comment


Anyway, I,m not a huge fan of brock, but proprs to him, he went in MMA to fight the best. He's clearly lacking in a lot of area (I was laughing when people said he would beat Ubereem), but he can still be a tough fight for a lot of people. Still, his wrestling is a bit overated (he wasnn't able to do anything to small old ass couture with his wrestling), his gas tanks suspect, and his standup skils, rudimentary at best. Honestly, i'm not sure he's a lot better than a prime Bob Sapp, who was a beast, no matter what people say now

 

I am pretty sure I said ".... might end up being....".

He has the size; he is very well-rounded; and is only getting better.

He could end up being the best HW in the history of the sport. He is a long way from being able to make that claim now, but it isn't outside the realm of possibility.

 

The size? He's actually a smaller HW and he isn't all that well rounded. He's a wrestler with average standup.

 

Smaller? Compared to Lesnar and Carwin he might be smaller, but he typically weighs more than JDS. If he hits the cage at 245-250, I consider that a big HW.

He isn't cutting to 265 like Lesnar but he also isn't a guy that comes in at 230 either. To me, he is the perfect size for HW. He is small enough to remain very quick yet isn't going to undersized against even the biggest HW's. The mammoth Lesnar couldn't throw him around so I think that bodes well for him NOT get tossed around by anyone else.


And for me, an All American wrestler, with a purple belt in Jiu-Jitsu and improving stand-up is pretty well-rounded. His stand up is where I always thought he was weakest, but he is definitely becoming a much better striker.