Kelly Pavlik to face Miguel Espino on December 19th

Personally, I just feel like people are jumping the gun and acting like Pavlik is some ducker when that has not been the case. I tend to give people the benifit of the doubt. I just think it's pretty far fatched that this whole situation was some plan for Pavlik to duck Williams. A more reasonable scenario is that he is indeed injured and he simply took a "Gimme" when Williams went with Martinez.

 

WHY Would Pavlik "Conveniently" SIGN to Face Espino AFTER he KNOWS Williams is ALREADY Fighting Sergio Martinez to PRESERVE the HBO Date???...WHY would Team Pavlik LIE & Say they Offered to Push the Williams Fight Back to 2 Weeks Later when in ACTUALITY they Requested a LATE January Date???....

Team Pavlik KNEW Paul Williams was ALREADY Signed to Fight Another Guy, Team Pavlik KNEW HBO was Gonna Do ANYTHING to Maintain the December 5th Date, yet they Make a BOGUS "Offer" to Williams to Fight 2 Weeks AFTER the Original Date on a Top Rank PPV???....They KNEW AHEAD of Time that Williams WOULDN'T Accept it...

For a Guy that LOOKS Under Every Stone & Rock to Label Floyd a DUCKER, U Sure R Turning a BLIND EYE to Shit that's RIGHT UNDER Your Nose...Whether it's Pavlik HIMSELF or Bob Arum, SOMEBODY within Team Pavlik DOESN'T Want him to Fight Paul Williams...



REED:hammert:

 

Unless they're Named "Floyd Mayweather", Right???....



REED::

 

That all could have been easily avoided had they NOT signed to begin with. Do you agree with that?

Now what would they have to gain by signing just to fake an injury and pull out? They sure as hell didn't gain any love from you. ::

 

In what situation did I not give Floyd the benifit of the doubt?

 

The PROBLEM is, Pavlik BACKED OUT of the Williams Fight Under the Premise of Being PHYSICALLY UNABLE to Perform on December 5th...Yet 1nce it's KNOWN that Paul Williams has MOVED ON, All of a Sudden, Pavlik's Conveniently Physically ABLE TO FIGHT AGAIN on December 19th???...A Mere 2 Weeks AFTER the Original Date that he was UNABLE to Perform On, Pavlik will B FINE???....

If Pavlik had Scheduled a Fight w/Espino for the 1st of the Year, NOBODY would Say Shit, but Rescheduling a Fight 2 Weeks AFTER the 1 U BACKED OUT Of is WEAK, Dude...As we Type, December 5th is STILL Nearly a MONTH Away, so Pavlik COULD have Realistically REMAINED In TRAINING as this "Staph Infection" Magically HEALED...



REED:hammert:

 

You aren't supposed to keep an ongoing count, you are supposed to get over things.

And fighters travel overseas far more today than they did in the past.

 

He is able ENOUGH for a Miguel Espino, not a Paul Williams. That is what I'm saying. You are acting as if they are even close in caliber.

 

Damn,that's an even bigger duck job than Haye did with both Klitschkos:notallthere:

 

I know huh? Pavlik's team doesn't mess around with this kind of stuff. They make the ducking so complicated and elaborate that it makes them look even worse than they would have if they had outright ducked Williams and didn't sign the contract to begin with. ::

Great plan, I'm sure they worked hard on this one,.

 

So just as Baseball Pitchers have "Tommy John" Surgery, Kelly Pavlik had a "Paul Williams" Staph Infection...Is that Anything like the "24 Hour" Flu...



REED::

 

Are Paul Williams and Miguel Espino on the same level? Is it safe to assume that Kelly Pavlik would not need to be 100% to defeat Miguel Espino?

 

I just feel the timing is bad - no matter who he is fighting. This injury has already caused him to postpone a major fight twice... shouldn't he heal this thing up? I see it as a bit of a slap in the face that he opts to postpone a match then schedules another one (no matter who it is against) merely two weeks later.

Either way you look at it - he postponed a fight with Paul Williams for a supposed life-threatening injury that has lingered on for multiple training camps, and he has turned around and scheduled a fight with a much lesser opponent for almost the same date that he couldn't show up for vs. Williams.....

if you are injured you shouldn't fight, especially if its a lingering, life threatening one. otherwise, when you pull out of a fight vs. a dangerous fighter and re-schedule a mere two weeks later vs. a pushover it seems an awful lot like you are ducking the dangerous fighter

 

I understand what you are saying and I'm not saying it looks good, it doesn't. I'm just saying it's just a little far fetched that Pavlik never intended to fight Williams and this was just some kind of crazy duck job from the beginning. That I will never believe, I do believe Pavlik had a serious staph infection and that is what led to this fight falling apart. If he didn't want to fight Williams he simply would not have signed.

 

Given his competition level, I doubt pavlik was spooked by paul williams, but theres clearly quite a bit wrong in his camp, whether its his attitude or the machinations of his management team, either way its been managed horribly and the year which should have seen him rebuild and become a bigger attraction has been a write off. Could be his best days are behind him already.

 

Arum/Pavlik clearly thought they could handle Hopkins. That was a calculated move. Hopkins had lost to Calzaghe, mroe importantly he had lost to Taylor twice, who Pavlik beat twice.

Arum always said we´ll fight Sturm and Abraham, but that was before Abraham showed his willingness to travel to the USA, into Mirandas backyard, and destroyed him. Now that Arum was on notice Abraham was willing to travel and was better than he expected, Arum suddenly was very quiet. Everybody knows Pavlik doesn´t have the greatest chin in the world and that Abraham presents a challenge.

And no Abraham is not and probably will never be a better fighter than Hopkins, but that puts him in good company, because there are a lot of fighters in the hall of fame, that aren´t better than Hopkins. I´ll say this though, I think Abraham would win a round against this version of Bernard Hopkins. ::

As it stands today Abraham would likely be favoured by the bookmakers against Pavlik. :kidcool:

 

Agreed. It's pretty sad his once promising career has grinded to a halt.

 

It was calculated, but it was still a huge risk. It's not as if they could have possibly thought it was going to be easy.

 

I honestly rarely think there is a case where one fighter is truly spooked or scared of another. But if Pavlik is taking on lesser fighters in order to build up his rep or hype instead of fighting williams because there is a higher chance that he loses - if he takes lesser risk fighters as part of a plan to pad a stretch of his career with more calculated risk opponents - does that really make it any more acceptable as a top fighter who is expected to take on the top challenges in and around his weight class?

 

He would have fought Williams given another 7 weeks though. So there was still willingness to fight him.

If you want to call him a ducker, go for it. It's not right but you are free to do what you want.

 

I haven't called him a ducker just yet - or if i have certainly not the the extent to be ridiculing him... but its just real suspicious

"He would've fought Williams" after ANOTHER delay? If you are Williams and his camp how long are you gonna be jerked around? A second delay? Another 7 weeks? That's another training camp.

If you have already delayed the fight once and then you "offer" to delay the fight again for another full training camp its hardly much of an offer... its more of a way to get out of the fight without coming out and saying "i don't want to fight this guy."

 

this fight sucks, but no need to call pavlik a pussy. i'm optimistic that he'll fight williams next year.

 

I commend you on how you stuck to your guns in this thread and defended your point of view so strongly. You gave great arguments. You remind me of me.

I kind of agree with your point of view moreso then the one shared by Reed and most everyone else. Still though, there is one thing I'm not sure you thought of. We all know Pav didn't have to sign if he never intended to fight Williams, but maybe he signed and realized afterwards that he didn't want to fight Williams. Maybe his team realized after signing, that Pav's confidence isn't where it should be after suffering the Hopkins defeat. That could be the very reason they're taking this Espino fight so quickly and out of the blue.

 

You could be right, we will never know for sure what exactly happened. I could be a combination of things. All I know is Williams isn't a guy you want to fight if you are not 100% ready. I really believe that is the reason it's not happening. I could be wrong, but I'm sticking to it.

 

My opinion of Pavlik dipped the most when he was short-sighted and grandiose enough, not to mention stupid and wrong, to say that the best fighters fight on HBO and that fights on Showtime weren't relevant.

 

I'm caught in two minds with this....on the face of it, it looks like a blatent duck job. He's not fit to fight on the 5th, because of this long term injury....yet two weeks later, he's ok?

But, on the other hand....to beat Paul Williams....Pavlik has to be 100%, or very close to that. To beat, Miguel Espino, and more importantly, keep hold of his title....he can afford to be 50%. And when you look at it from that perspective, it makes sense. But on that, we have to take Pavlik's word for it...that this injury truly exists and that it forces him out of a Williams clash.

If Pavlik doesn't move to re-arrange the Williams fight as soon as possible, then the hardcore fans aren't gonna let him forget this in a hurry....this will stay with him.

 

Pavlik isn't stupid. You don't fight Williams unless you are 100%. He would have been for sure in January. You do fight Miguel Espino even if you might not be 100%. Williams didn't want to wait. Don't blame him. Pavlik decided to do something since Williams wouldn't wait. Don't blame him either. *Z* is spot on.

They will fight later, perhaps their next fight.

 

& If/When they DON'T???...


REED:dunno:

 

When did he say that?

I guess he was just kissing HBO's arse to keep his contract safe ::

 

This why I find it so very easy to insult most you idiot clowns. This is an absolutely disgusting and cowardly move by Pussy Pavlik. How any of you can defend him is beyond reason.