More important: "Controlling distance" or Landing more punches?

I think you aren't the only 1.

 

Twisting words once again.

That's almost as bad as Juan Manuel's manager saying the "WBC" is out to get the Marquez brothers. ::

 

Controlling the distance has closed the distance and has taken the lead.

 

how I'm I twisting words? watch the fucking post fight conference.

there is an interview with Roach 3 days after the fight and again he said he thought Manny was gonna quit.

maybe you should tell Roach he is full of shit. After all he was there in the corner what does he know right? ::

 

marquez was landing more clean, effective punches throughout the fight.

 

Right.

So is the WBC looking to "get" the Marquez brothers? :laughing:

 

5-4...

This Threads Working Out WELL for Bama, Thus Far...


REED::

 

5-5 and one vote for "distance" was an obvious throw. So it's really 5-4.

 

That wasn't an option :nono:

 

This would explain Manny turning down a rematch, when asked immediately after the fight. From that one guys sig, it looked like he wanted no more of Marquez. That right there is enough to make me respect Marquez win or lose.

 

It also explains why Arum is asking for 8-10 million for a 3rd fight with Marquez ::

 

They are both important. Marquez was more effective at landing punches and keeping distance. So it really doesn't matter.

 

::

 

wow, how INSECURE can a person get?

 

:: :bears:

 

Marquez outlanded Pacquiao 172-157 in the fight. He also "controlled the distance" throughout, so this thread somewhat backfired on our Pinoy friend.

 

We're going by rounds, not totals, that's not how fights are scored.

Pacquiao doubled Marquez's connects in the first round, and people are claiming the first round "could've" been a Marquez round which makes me think some people just don't know how to score fights.

For the record, Pacquiao outlanded marquez in 6 of the 12 rounds, and in one round they tied, but Pacquiao threw 16 more punches in that tied up round. Round 8 kind of skews the numbers a bit because Pacquiao retreated that round to recover from his cut eye. Once he did, he pasted Marquez in rounds 9 and 10.

Throw in the fact that Marquez was knocked down twice (once officially), and badly staggered in round 10, anyone who claims this was a robbery is just being dishonest. The right person got the decision.

 

::

okay. just admit it was a big mistake to start this thread. it's cool, we won't run you off the site again.

 

Rounds aren't scored by punch stats either, necessarily.

And 'Bama....you yourself have used punch stats to prop up your assessments of past fights.

Matter of fact, you clearly said that John had landed more punches than Marquez in the punch stats - when actually, that was wrong. Marquez outlanded John in overall punches and SIGNIFICANTLY in power punches.

So - I agree that totals aren't necessarily the way to go; but fact is punch stats can be deceiving even within a round...though it's a slightly more accurate diagnostic.

If you're going that round, Marquez won his rounds with a much higher advantage in both overall connects and power punch connects. He won his rounds bigger. Manny's rounds had much smaller margins. If you look at only power punches, Marquez wins even bigger and he has the 6-7 round edge in "rounds won because of punch stat numbers."

:dunno: That's without accounting for the fact that Compubox does NOT account for punches that land clean vs. those that are partially deflected or blocked. It also does not account for how CLEAN or HARD a punch lands.

Hence, even 'within rounds' it can be deceiving.

Marquez was officially knocked down once, period. Saying he 'should have' been penalized for his glove briefly touching the ropes makes no difference to the actual scoring....just like Manny being visibly hurt three times in the fight isn't always factored in (and I can provide you the round and time if you need it).

It was a close fight...either man could have won; the KD edged it for Pacquiao.

Great fight by both men and a classic.

Peace.

 

9-7. :dunno:

Actually 9-6 because whiskey admitted that he threw his vote out of spite.

I'd say it was a success.

 

Yup.

 

Perhaps so, Donny. The ref blew the second knockdown, but there's no doubt that the ropes held him up. It should have counted as a knockdown.

Just a musing on the bout, it seemed like a marked difference in firepower existed between Marquez and Pac, with Pac having the .9mm as opposed to Marquez's Smith and Wesson .22.

Judges are swayed by the harder shots as well, and Pac threw them. The scored knockdown looked like Marquez had been shot in the face. it was BRUTAL-looking at the time and extremely eyecatching. :eeeek:

 

I think there is reasonable doubt. How do we know he wouldn't have staggered and held himself up (see Pavlik-Taylor I)? Point is - it was not scored, and using it as "evidence" does not change the scoring. Should it 'technically' have been called a KD? Sure, assuming those rules applied (not sure, some states do not have that rule). But it wasn't. And we're discussing scoring, not speculation.

I tend to disagree on that. Marquez hurt Pac several times and buzzed him - some of his shots made Manny literally stand up straight. I think this is a generalization.

See above. I do agree on the KD - it looked like Marquez had been shot. Still, it's one point.

 

Just saying the way it looked to me. Opinions vary. :dunno: :clap:

 

Absolutely. Again, close fight any way you slice it - and more importantly, a GREAT one.

I loved the fact that overall tendencies aside, Marquez sometimes outfought Manny on the inside/mid-distance...and Manny sometimes outfought Marquez at long-distance.

JMM incorporated the lead left hook (something he usually doesn't do) to great effect this fight, sometimes hurting Manny with it as it was unexpected.

Pacquiao used his right hand very well - and stayed with JMM in the jab department.

The skill level and the drama/tension were great (Manny's sometimes sloppy footwork aside :: ).

Peace.

 

marquez landed constantly, while pac landed the most damaging shots. He rocked pac with right hands all night through. of course pac landed, but marquez was more consistent. and that beating he gave him in the 8th was brutal. Hurting pac to the body and all. Even Pacquiao seemed to concede defeat when they were reading the scorecards, he walked towards marquez to congratulate him and his expression of surprise was Mosley-esque ::

 

it was a success if you intended to prove that Marquez was better. I also voted for landing more punches. Marquez controlled the distance and landed more, and had a beter connect percentage.

 

Yup. Exactly how I saw it. While Marquez would land the occasional solid shot, when Marquez was hit by a Pacquiao power shot, you heard it throughout the arena. When Marquez gets tagged in the 3rd it sounds like a gunshot.

Interesting to note, this is the second time Bayless has missed a Pacquiao knockdown. In round 2 of the Pac-Morales rematch, he missed calling a knockdown when Morales went sprawling into the ropes and held on to stay up.

 

In Round 1, Pacquiao landed twice as many punches as Marquez. So do you agree that Round 1 would be Pac's?

 

Landed more overall, landed less on a round by round basis which is how fights are scored the last time I checked.